The State Of Real Estate And Inflation with Jason Hartman and Elisabeth Embry

In this episode, Jason Hartman is hosted by Elisabeth Embry’s Women’s Investing Network podcast. He explains how a normal business cycle and foreign investments can affect commercial real estate in cyclical markets and the ways the government manipulates and lies about the inflation rate. Jason also shares how a country’s demographic challenges can limit their economic outlook.

Announcer 0:01
This show is produced by the Hartman media company. For more information and links to all our great podcasts, visit Hartman

Announcer 0:14
Welcome to the creating wealth show with Jason Hartman. You’re about to learn a new slant on investing some exciting techniques and fresh new approaches to the world’s most historically proven asset class that will enable you to create more wealth and freedom than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine self made multi millionaire who’s actually been there and done it. He’s a successful investor, lender, developer and entrepreneur who’s owned properties in 11 states had hundreds of tenants and been involved in thousands of real estate transactions. This program will help you follow in Jason’s footsteps on the road to your financial independence day. You really can do it on now. here’s your host, Jason Hartman With the complete solution for real estate investors.

Jason Hartman 1:04
So you’ve heard my rants about how our financial system is rigged, and I’ve interviewed hundreds of experts to back up those claims and help you align your investments with the most powerful forces in the world, governments and central banks. I’m also using a perpetual wealth strategy with my income property investments that you should check out. It has enhanced the security of my liquid assets, boosted overall ROI, and shifted money away from the banksters my friend Pat Donahoe, who’s one of our venture Alliance members, runs paradigm life and he has a free report that you can download at be your that’s B, your check it out today. Welcome to the creating wealth show, episode number 873 873. This is your host, Jason Hartman. Thank you so much. for joining me today. This is actually a little bit of an odd intro today. I am in Sacramento, California, visiting my aunt Joan, who you’ve heard on the show before and many of you talked about what? How much you enjoyed hearing her story of how she built this real estate Empire kind of the old school way here in in Sacramento and just buying in the neighborhood and doing it over the course of many decades and got up to about 100 houses give or take. And unfortunately, we recently lost my uncle john and Sam Jones husband, they were married for 59 years. Wow. 59 years. You don’t see that kind of stuff anymore nowadays Do you often do you I’m actually at the cemetery where john is buried and just got to tour everything with Joan and see the whole thing and so it’s just been great up here visiting her and and visiting My cousins and so forth. But today, I’m going to replay an interview I did with Elizabeth, just last week. And Elizabeth actually kind of interviewed me, I was kind of interviewing her. It’s really not an interview. It’s more of a discussion, I guess, I should say. But I thought it would be valuable for you to hear that. But before we get to that, we’re going to go ahead and wrap up the contest for the Amazon Echo, and get that done. So that’s Hartman education comm slash contest. We will wrap up that contest here at the end of the week and announce the winner next week. Remember, with our little contest that we have, your odds are always very good, because you know, we only have like six listeners in the whole world. Just kidding. But your odds are good. Always enter those contests when we have them. Hartman education comm slash contest. And then I also wanted to mention, we have a very limited offer for people who would like to get a free one hour onboarding session with Zach. Zach is our customer service person for property tracker and real estate tools. He will help you get all of your stuff organized and loaded into the property tracker software, and make it nice and easy for you to get started and be a very organized real estate investor. So that as a free one hour onboarding session with Zach for the first 20 people who want to sign up for a property tracker, just go to Jason Hartman calm and click on the property tracker, Link an image that you see right on the front page, and you can get signed up and get your free one hour onboarding session. Remember, that’s a very limited offer. So take advantage of that. It’ll really really help get you going. I guess that’s pretty much it for today. We’ve got our meet the Masters coming up tickets have been selling like crazy. That’s in January. And you can sign up for that at Jason Hartman calm in the events section as well get some early bird pricing price. has increased for that, but it’s still a good early bird price and it’s going to be quite an event this year. So we’ve had more advanced ticket sales this time than any other time. We’ve hosted it in the past. So Jason Hartman calm in the event section for that. Uncle john will surely be missed. He was such a knowledgeable man, I he taught me so much throughout the course of my life. He was a pilot for many years. He had a military funeral and he he was just a great guy and, and quite an inspiration in terms of real estate too, for sure. What my aunt uncle did over over the course of decades. I saw them do it as I was growing up and it’s hanging out with my aunt here the last few days. I tell you, she’s, she just she just tickles me because I rented this little car, a little mini cooper car a little convertible Mini Cooper. I’m driving her round and Coco the dog is in the backseat and it’s impossible to drive anywhere with my Because, and Joan keeps telling me about every house we pass. It’s just so funny. john was the same way, maybe a little more quiet than and Joan, you drive around town here and, and Joan is telling me about this house and that house and this architecture and that architecture and it’s just like real estate is in their blood. So uncle john will be missed. And let’s get to our main segment today. And that’ll be Elizabeth chatting with me and we’re talking about a variety of subjects. I think you’ll enjoy them.

Elisabeth Embry 6:31
Welcome to another exciting episode of the women investing network. I’m your co host, Elizabeth Embry. And today I have our co host, Jason Hartman, Jason and welcome.

Jason Hartman 6:41
Thank you, Elizabeth. How’s everybody doing out there? You know,

Elisabeth Embry 6:44
I think it’s been about 30 episodes since we last spoke. So it’s flies. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And you just got back from a whirlwind European vacation.

Jason Hartman 6:58
Yeah, I don’t know how much we can It was it felt like I was pretty connected, working a lot. So I would say it was a trip. I don’t know if it was a total vacation, but it was a little bit of vacation. I mean, I guess certainly as much as I have at home, because you know, you’re not always working when you’re at home either. But that was my second trip to Europe this year. So this year, I spent seven weeks in Europe and boy, I just kind of want to experience a little more because I think it’s falling apart. their economies are just falling apart. In in Europe, it’s it’s amazing. But you know, they’ve got huge demographic problems, immigration problems, economic problems, like

Elisabeth Embry 7:37
us amplified in many ways, it seems.

Jason Hartman 7:39
Yeah, that’s, I guess that’s a good way to look at it. I mean, it’s a whole different set of circumstances, of course, but you know, Eastern Western are very different. I was in both this time and last time. But you know, as we were talking about before we started recording for this. It’s really valuable, I think, to travel just as for a human, you know, just for life to understand and gain perspective on the world. I’ve always said that before someone should be allowed to hold public office, they should be required to travel the world and own a business, you know, have a broad perspective and support people and have the obligation to actually make payroll every two weeks. good experience for politicians, right. But I

Elisabeth Embry 8:19
think the travel just gives you such a neat perspective. Now, one of the things that you were talking about is like all of the troubles that you’ve been seeing, and all of the I’m assuming some fun stuff, too. How has that impacted your thoughts around as an entrepreneur as a business person? How are those things impacting your thinking? Well, when you say troubles, what do you mean? Oh, well, for instance, you were talking about the immigration challenges, the population challenges, the economic challenges that you’re seeing in in Europe.

Jason Hartman 8:46
You know, one thing is for sure, and I guess the most prescient lesson for it is Japan. If a country doesn’t have a birth rate, it basically becomes extinct. I mean, the environmental impacts This saying they always say talk about when they refer to species extinction. They say extinction is forever. extinction is forever. And that’s true of people in countries too. So, you know, when you look at Japan, and they used to call it the last decade, and now we can call it the last two decades, actually entering the last third decade, it’s not necessarily an economic problem, per se that Japan has what it really has is a demographic problem. And when you don’t have when you don’t have young people coming in to support the old people, that makes society lopsided, and the reason the US has escaped that, because the birth rate among the what you’d call not really natives, because nobody’s really much of a native except American Indians in the US, but the sort of native us people for the last 200 years, right or 100. Is those people aren’t having many children, but the US has taken on a lot of immigration. So that’s the way the US has kind of escaped That problem because the immigrants are paying into the system. And even you know, and then of course, the US has the reserve currency, the world and all kinds of advantages that other countries don’t have, it can print money, till the end of time and not be really held accountable for it, like other countries have to be. And so, you know, but that is one way that the US has escaped some of the problems that say Japan is facing, and other countries to look at this example are Russia, and in 10 years, China, I mean, China, Elizabeth, because their one child policy is going to they don’t have it yet. It hasn’t hit them yet. But the thing with demographics, is you you can absolutely, positively know what’s going to happen. You know, in 10 years, everybody will be 10 years older, there’s no question about that. Right. And, and so it’s a really sort of easy thing to project right as some some other things are very hard to protect,

Elisabeth Embry 10:56
right. And then when you’ve got these patterns of places like Japan, where You’ve seen you know, how their culture and how their their birth rate and their demographics have have played out over time. You can see that established pattern and then see those other countries starting to follow that.

Jason Hartman 11:11
Oh, no, no question. Yeah. And and if you don’t have those young people working to sport the old people as they retire and live too long in retirement, I mean, when social security was invented, the average lifespan was like four years after retirement. Now it’s 30. Okay, so you can see there’s a problem there. Right. We have another show that you’re all too familiar with called the longevity and biohacking show, another podcast. And there are just huge wide ranging issues here that affect societies all over the world because people are just living so much longer. And not only are they living longer, but they’re living healthier. I mean, why the heck should we have 65 isn’t the sort of retirement age if you will, I mean, retirement well I propose that retirement is not good for people. You could retire, I could retire. I have zero interest in retiring. Because as soon as you retire, you probably gonna die pretty soon.

Elisabeth Embry 12:11
People ask me often they’re like, Elizabeth, why don’t you just kick back at this point? You know, your real estate wealth has helped you enough that it covers so much money, find an island and kick back. And I’m thinking of like, just don’t want to that doesn’t sound like much fun on Oh,

Jason Hartman 12:27
you got to be stimulated and engaged in life. And it’s not really about the money. It’s about doing cool things in creating I mean, and contributing Yeah, and contributing. You know, I mean, you hosting your show, for example, Elizabeth is, is one of your forms of art. Okay. It’s It’s hard. It’s just like Steven Spielberg making a movie or George Lucas or whatever. It’s hard.

Elisabeth Embry 12:52
For me. I mean, it’s an opportunity to give back to the young women and men that are becoming entrepreneurs. They’re growing their careers, they’re just starting to think about their wealth strategy and starting to build that foundation. I mean, being able to give them that one stop shop of not just my knowledge, not just your knowledge and your knowledge is extensive. I mean, you’ve been doing this for a number of years, you know, a thing or two. But the fact that we’re pulling in all these amazing speakers with their perspectives as well, it’s, it’s a really a great opportunity to really contribute and help others grow to become, you know, successful as well.

Jason Hartman 13:28
Absolutely. Yeah. I couldn’t agree more.

Elisabeth Embry 13:30
So when you’re having these conversations, you’re going into it sorry, when you’re going into these different locations, you’re starting to be able to strike up conversations with the people that around you, you’re getting these fresh perspectives to and that’s one of the things I love about traveling, because then I’m learning about things or I’m hearing about an existing, you know, a challenge an idea, whatever, but from somebody completely different impression, a different way of training a different way of thinking.

Jason Hartman 13:57
Mm hmm. No, no, no, no question about I mean, that’s just a really important thing to gain perspectives, and just look at the way things are done and look at the sort of gadgets people use, and they just have these whole different ways of thinking. That’s what, you know, I always say, Elizabeth, I have this morbid fascination with communism. I would really love to go to North Korea. Scared, yes. Why don’t go down? Yeah, yeah, no, I’m not going. But I’ve been to Cuba, and I’ve been to pretty much everywhere in the Eastern Bloc, and I’ve been to Russia. It’s really quite fascinating to see how, how people think, you know, in the in these places, it’s really just eye opening. It really is.

Elisabeth Embry 14:41
Absolutely. So speaking of perspectives, you know, I’ve been, as you know, historically, really focused on residential. I don’t know that much about commercial real estate. And I had an opportunity to meet with this local group in here in Seattle, this local group of women, bad assets. I mean, these women are just Really at the top of their game, they work in some of the largest commercial real estate companies in the US here in the Seattle area. I know on one of your recent shows in creating wealth you talked about where all the cranes are going. And you know, that’s a foreshadowing of not only the work that’s here today, but all of the ability, all the places that people could friend or live in the future, but that it can get to a tipping point, it can become a bubble. Now, here in Seattle, I’ve seen a 10 year cycle in residential and commercial, you know, that’s been like clockwork. And so for me, it felt very frothy. The perspective of these women who are very knowledgeable, very experienced was that now we’re just going to get right blow right past that 10 year dip because there’s so much business coming in the area, and there’s so much demand coming. And I was really surprised and I’d love to get your thoughts because for me, I’ve got these Tried and trued indicators when I’m looking at a market. And from their perspective, they were like, nope, this time it’s different.

Jason Hartman 16:06
Okay, right. And by the way, Elizabeth, I’m so glad you said those words, because those are the famous last words of every investor who who eats it. This time, it’s different. Be very careful with that kind of thinking. Okay? They always say, I mean, from back to the days of tulip mania, Okay, a couple hundred years ago, they always say, This time, it’s different. So those words are very dangerous words. But just want to make sure the listeners and I understand what your argument is, is that there’s a business cycle, right? Is that what you mean when you talk about 10 years?

Elisabeth Embry 16:44
Yes. So in Seattle, you know, I was working at Washington Mutual on the it site that for home loans, I’ve lived here since 89. And every 10 years like clockwork, we get this massive construction of the of the residential market. And then all of a sudden, there’s something that happens and he can’t give away a house. You know, for instance, my residence fluctuated on literally 100%. Over the last 10 years. I always see this, this cycle of you know, it’s a very cyclical market. Everybody’s flush with cash and real estate is very tight. And then all of a sudden, you know, real estate is very prevalent. You can buy a house for really inexpensive, everything goes 30 40% below its high, and then it starts coming back out. No,

Jason Hartman 17:31
well, okay, so let’s examine that. So why Has that happened? Because, you know, part of the business cycles, there’s this concept of as the economy starts to take off, people start feeling more comfortable, there’s a wealth effect. They have more cash in their pocket, they have more equity in their house, their businesses doing well, their job is doing well. You know, maybe they’re getting a raise or they’re climbing the corporate ladder. You know, businesses are expanding. They’re opening a new location or putting in new infrastructure and technology. And that has a multiplier effect because it creates jobs. So all of this stuff’s happened, right? They they stock up on in the increase their inventories. And you know, there’s all these trailing effects in the economy from all this spending, right? And then it goes too far. And then they wonder, Well, now I’ve got all this infrastructure. I’ve got these new locations, I’ve got more inventory, I’ve got more systems, I can handle more business and where all the customers we overbuilt and that happens in the real estate market. It happens in virtually everything

Elisabeth Embry 18:42
right in the 80s. in Dallas, they just overbuilt so much that I think it wasn’t, I don’t know, it was like a half a decade before they started filling all of those different commercial buildings. You know, I think yeah, those are the see through buildings.

Jason Hartman 18:56
Okay. So so they have those in Dallas in Houston. They’ve had them all over What that means is, you know, there’s no tenants inside those beautiful glass office buildings, you can see right through them. Right. Right. And so yeah, that’s that’s certainly happens. The only thing I would say is and you’ve heard me talk extensively, I know you probably plug your ears and don’t want to hear it about Trump, our childhood. President, Donald Trump, okay. Our president who thinks he’s Blair on Gossip Girl, or he’s still running a reality show. I don’t know which, but love him or hate him. Okay. And, you know, I love them a little more than hate him even though I mean, I just think he’s like a kook. Okay, in, in a bit of a way. But I’ll tell you something, regardless of what you think of him, he is loosening the floodgates of money. Okay. And in real estate, there’s this thing that we’ve talked about extensively before and I’ve talked about very extensively on my show, called Dodd Frank. Right. And this was a very poorly written 20 page bill. It has really constricted the real estate market. And Trump wants to repeal or at least soften Dodd Frank. And as that happens, more money will flow. And as lending requirements are loosened, more money will flow into the market. So that’s one thing to know. Okay. The other thing to know is that when you look at these, like the business cycle, and the business cycle is a legitimate thing. Okay. It certainly has happened throughout history. But remember, we came off a very low. So the question is, is it fair to argue that during the Great Recession, the worst economy we had in seven decades? Is it fair to say that well, the cycle started in 2000. And well really want to say 2007? That would be 10 years but say it started in 2008 or nine Right. So nine or 10 years it’s been going right. You could argue, and or even 2010. So seven years, it’s been going the economy has been on an upward trend since then. And so it’s time for a recession. Right? That would be the thinking. But I would kind of caution against that thinking a little bit only because we really didn’t get to sort of par it until maybe 2012. Mm hmm. Okay. So we’ve only really been in the boom for five years, I would argue,

Elisabeth Embry 21:31
fair enough. It’s like whether you’re trending up or trending down, I just remember. So I view Seattle’s health by the traffic on the street. And what I mean by that is in 2000, when we had the tech crash, the tech bubble, you could get anywhere in 15 minutes. Now the same distance takes you an hour and a half, right? So when people aren’t working, that’s when there’s no traffic when people are working. It takes you forever. And we’ve had these very consistent almost by like clockwork, these these outside catalysts that force the cycle, but it magically happens in this 10 year cycle, where, you know, for instance, Boeing was the largest employer in the area. And you know, in the late 80s, it started laying off people, then there was the tech bubble. Then there was, you know, the recession, there was, you know, there was just all of these things that very consistently happen. And so I think it’s fair to say it’s like, Where are you actually out in that cycle? But it still feels very frothy to me.

Jason Hartman 22:35
Yeah, well, okay, so now that we kind of addressed that part of the general business cycle concept. Now, I think it would be fair to look at specific real estate markets. And then of course, we got to do our usual thing and you’ve talked about this a lot to your listeners. The three basic types of real estate markets around the world doesn’t matter where you are, okay? It’s all the same list. Near cyclical and hybrid markets, okay, those are the three basic types of real estate markets. A linear market is one of these boring markets. You don’t hear about it on the news it chugs along and does its thing. That’s what we like. We like those linear, very reliable markets. The cyclical market is Seattle, LA, virtually all of the West Coast, the expensive Northeastern markets, South Florida, Paris, Hong Kong, Dubai. You know, London, all of these frothy all these trophy places around the world are cyclical markets. And cyclical markets have big glorious highs and really ugly lows. Okay, there they are a rollercoaster ride. And then there’s the hybrid market, which is the sort of in between hybrids would be Austin, Texas, Phoenix, Denver, places like that. Yeah, Atlanta wood is now hybrid, but before it was pretty linear, but yeah, now I would call it Hybrid, you’re right. So in the cyclical markets, we are way past the point of fundamentals. Like nothing makes sense in Los Angeles or Seattle. You know, these markets are they’re very overvalued. But But here’s the thing. The question is, like, just because I said they’re overvalued, and we’re past the point of fundamentals, and I know, Elizabeth, you’d agree with that. Just because we said that, and it’s true, doesn’t mean they’re gonna crash tomorrow. Okay.

Elisabeth Embry 24:30
Well, I don’t care appointees and that is a fair point.

Jason Hartman 24:32
Yeah, nobody knows. The question is, how long can it go on? And nobody really knows the answer to that. Because, you know, even though the market is massively overvalued today, if Dodd Frank gets repealed, and, you know, a bunch more money flows into the real estate market, hey, it’s gonna keep going. We’re kicking the can down the road.

Elisabeth Embry 24:54
Okay. So one of the things that I think that Trump has been really clear on is he his frustration with our existing trade agreements like NAFTA, and immigration and just in general now, in a lot of the coastal markets, we’ve got a lot of Russian and Chinese investors really snapping up real estate left and right. So let me ask you this knowing that we’re in an inventory shortage, do you actually think it’s a good thing if they start getting blocked from buying? Or do you think it’s a bad thing? Because now the prices for the existing real estate are gonna start dipping?

Jason Hartman 25:32
I think they distort the market. Okay. That kind of foreign investment distorts markets. It’s illogical because a lot of those so called investors and I wouldn’t call them investors at all, are very wealthy people from overseas that are literally just parking money, because their countries are so corrupt and so unreliable, that you know, America, I mean, it has great rule of law. Okay, you know, we can complain all day about, you know how the court systems are a mess and everybody Sue’s each other here and all that kind of stuff. And you know, that’s all true. But compared to what I mean, weird What? I mean, I mean, America has fantastic rule of law, investors from around the world. Always they call America the Brinks truck, because it is a safe place to store your money. So a lot of these foreign investors in all the places you mentioned, are literally, I mean, they’re buying stupid things, right? A lot of them buy high rise condos, that makes zero cents, and they they just leave them vacant,

Elisabeth Embry 26:39
right? They just, they just like you said they’re parking their money.

Jason Hartman 26:42
They’re just literally parking money. And it’s better than putting it in their own country. You know, a lot of times it’s a diversification strategy. It’s a safety strategy. It’s they don’t trust their own government. They don’t trust their banking system. I mean, I was talking to someone on ARM too. Yeah, I was talking to a Ukrainian girl. When I was in Prague just a few weeks ago, and she said the Ukrainian banks, the joke is that if you put your money in the bank in Ukraine, will you ever get it back? Like, you know, that’s that’s basically what we’re dealing I mean, the stuff we take for granted, other people do not take this for credit,

Elisabeth Embry 27:18
okay. And I know that even just in their day to day habits like you’re mentioning, in Russia, it’s common for you to put your pay voucher into an ATM, you pull all the money out, and then you put the money back in and you pay your utility bill, you pay your water bill, you pay your cell phone bill, you even buy travel through a kiosk, this same kiosk, this kiosk functions as like a transfer station, because nobody wants to leave any money with the bank. They don’t even want to leave it in there for a second.

Jason Hartman 27:47
You know, what’s going to be really interesting. I mean, I always say it’s an amazing time to be alive. And what’s going to be really interesting, and we’re starting to see an inkling of it now, and I think it’s super exciting. Although I don’t know what it really means yet. It’s too To tell t TT too early to tell is that innovation in the banking world and payment systems, certainly there have been the cryptocurrencies which by the way, I wouldn’t risk too much on that, because I think that that’ll be squashed. But there’s all kinds of like peer to peer models that are rising up and, and just different interesting things in the world of banking. You know, so much of the world is unbanked that I think this is gonna I think it’s gonna be really good.

Elisabeth Embry 28:27
Yeah, I think of the fact that the your phone the mobile currency systems, your phone actually works like a wallet. And we have very little like Apple Pay or Android Pay in businesses as a norm. So for instance, I think there’s here locally, there’s Chevron stations that’ll take Apple Pay and Home Depot. Those are the things right, but I will take it Okay, good. So there’s three stores you know, you can get

Jason Hartman 28:55
Trader Joe’s takes Apple Pay two.

Elisabeth Embry 28:58
Okay, so you can get an apple You can buy a hammer

Elisabeth Embry 29:04
some aspirin. Yeah. But you know, it does seem like we’ve really got to get off the, the concepts of, you know, the standard wallet. And I know we’ve talked about this a number of times, but the fact that the US dollar, it’s anybody’s guess where inflation is really. And so the value that’s perceived versus the value that it is, it’ll be interesting to see where it goes, especially since it seems like things are going faster. The changes are taking place faster these days.

Jason Hartman 29:33
Absolutely, they are. Hey, Elizabeth, you know what, I’m glad you mentioned inflation, because I talk about that a lot on my creating wealth show. But I want to just talk about that for a moment if we can with your listeners. And of course, the government manipulate some lies about the true inflation rate. And there are two main reasons for the government to want to do that. Number one is that all of these government, employees, their pay and all the entitlement programs, disability, Social Security, etc. They’re all indexed to inflation. So the lower they state the inflation rate to be, the less the government has to pay. That’s one reason. The other reason is because just generally, you know, if you want to keep the populace happy, you’ve got to mislead them into thinking things are better than they are. Okay. So the ways that the government mainly manipulates the inflation rate is with substitution, hedonic and waiting, okay. And when you look at an index, like the CPI, the consumer price index, they’ll substitute things. So if the price of beef goes up, they’ll just substitute it for chicken and they’ll say everybody will just eat chicken instead of beef and you know everything. There’s no inflation, okay? And when technology gets better, and you buy a new laptop computer, and that computer is twice as good as the last one you owned, but it costs the same price. They’ll say you only paid half the price for it when you really pay the whole price for it, because they’ll say it’s twice as good, which is an absurd idea. Because hedonic adjustments, basically say that we, as people aren’t entitled to progress, the progress goes to the inflation index rather than to us.

Elisabeth Embry 31:11
Fair. That’s ridiculous.

Jason Hartman 31:12
Could you imagine Elizabeth Warren had dynamically indexing everything in the world since the time the wheel was invented. So the wheel made things so much better than, you know, horses or walking on foot before we had the wheel. So we should just say, Donnelly, adjust everything because thousand times better, we’ll assume it only costs 1000 times less, and then waiting just how much they wait each item in the index, right? Mm hmm. But there’s another hidden thing here. And, Elizabeth, you’ve been there like when we were in Seattle at our venture Alliance retreat that you and your husband Neal helped us host up there. You remember our venture Alliance member Jeff, and he was just so funny and he was having a couple of drinks and he was just ranting about inflation, right? And saying, there’s just not Really hardly any inflation, blah, blah, blah. But I beg to differ. Because when you look around the world now and live your life, you got to notice that even though the price of something may not have changed that much, number one, it got smaller and lesser. So the bag of chips weighs less than it did, okay? And there’s all kinds of ways that they’re cheating us. They’re the chocolate bars on as big as it was, etc, etc. But the big one is this, you’re ready. It’s self service. We are doing so much stuff ourself nowadays, when we go online and buy an airline ticket, no one’s helping us do that anymore. It’s all self service, right? I mean, we’ve been pumping our own gas for decades. Now. Do you remember I when I was a kid, we used to have full serve and self serve and the guy would cheat

Elisabeth Embry 32:52
in Oregon, but they also have income to you no state income tax and all sorts of taxation to cover for that and the incident indicated in The price as well, but you’re right. I mean, I, I’ve been trying to sell some property.

Jason Hartman 33:06
Oh, yeah, with roof stock. Yeah.

Elisabeth Embry 33:12
Yeah, it hasn’t gone as well as I’d hoped. But you know, the shtick is, you know, you’re gonna have less of a fee, because you’re gonna be, you’re gonna be doing a certain amount of self service, it’s going to be easy, right? And I’ll tell you the amount of effort I put into that, I really wish that they would have just charged me the full price, you know, in order to

Jason Hartman 33:31
index your time into the inflation index with all of the stuff you do yourself nowadays. And then you’ll really know the inflation rate. There’s been a lot more inflation than you think. I mean, all day long. I’m just doing everything myself, right. who’s helping me anymore? You got a call and wait on hold forever when you call any company. And then you’re talking to, you know, some drone in the Philippines who’s reading a script. I mean, it’s super annoying.

Elisabeth Embry 33:59
The thing that gets me As I can’t handle the Self Service checkout line, I will actually wait in line for a teller one because I don’t want all the jobs to go away. I actually want the tellers or the checkout people to still be there. Because I actually like service.

Jason Hartman 34:14
And while you’re fighting, you’re fighting a valiant fight for the working class hero against a trend you will not win I automation will win your

Elisabeth Embry 34:27
frustrates me to no end. I don’t know how to bag I don’t want to know how to bag I want somebody to just run this stuff through bag it for me, maybe even take it to my car like back in the day. Nobody does that anymore. Yeah,

Jason Hartman 34:40
no, it’s it’s a different world. Self Service, folks. You’re doing a lot of stuff yourself nowadays. And that is part of the inflation rate. It’s deceiving. But think about how your life was 30 years ago, and you didn’t do all this stuff yourself. You had a travel agent. You had a concierge person that would get you tickets. For events, you know, all kinds of stuff is self serve nowadays. You know what drives me nuts? Is these and I call me terrible Okay, maybe I’m a terrible person but I was in New York I had to stay one night in JFK on the way back. And I was at the hotel, and I go down to breakfast to have the, you know, $19 breakfast Okay, in the crappy $19 breakfast in the hotel. coffee and a Danish maybe? Well, no, there were some crappy scrambled eggs too. But the so called waiter. All he did is put the check on my table. He never said do you want any coffee or water I had to get up, get my own coffee, my own water, everything self serve completely. And there’s a space for tip. And you know what I wrote in I wrote self service. And no tip. Yeah, I didn’t write note but I just wrote self service. Like why should I leave a tip he didn’t do anything except put the check on my table. And now I’m going to hear from people saying you’re terrible. Look at all these restaurants now that are like these modern restaurants where you go up to the counter and you place your order at a restaurant, and they turn the little screen around like the little iPad cash register, and the tip is either 15% or no it’s 18% 20% 25% or 30%. For what are you this is self service.

Elisabeth Embry 36:25
And the reason why people are gonna say Jason you’re a meanie is because they’re saying the guy has to or that person has to survive off their tips because we’ve already created this situation where they’re only we’re already saying provide the absolute minimal amount of service because we’re going to try to automate everything and so that person that that ratio of you know, waiter to restaurant attendees, so to speak, you know, person at the restaurant is probably one to 30 so he doesn’t even have the bandwidth to provide any decent type of service let alone did he not get any training but his employer is probably putting in a wage that doesn’t even allow for him to have a living wage. Unless he got a bunch of tips.

Jason Hartman 37:06
Right? I hear the liberal coming out. Yes, I know, I don’t disagree with you. I just think that people have got to stop viewing these minimum wage jobs as careers. They were never meant to be careers. When I was a kid, you would work at McDonald’s when you were in high school, and then you would actually get a real job eventually, right? You know, but now we’ve got this whole class of the working poor, and I admit it’s really sad. But the solution is not the Bernie Sanders $15 minimum wage solution, because that’s just going to create more inflation, and more automation and less jobs. what the solution is that you got to stop looking at these things as careers, you should not work at Taco Bell or Starbucks for any more than a year. Okay, when you’re like a kid, that’s what it’s for. It’s They’re not careers.

Elisabeth Embry 38:01
So I’m going to shift gears on you because one of the lists there’s I was talking with the other day, asked me a question, and I didn’t have a good answer for and I know you know the answer to this, which is she missed

Jason Hartman 38:13
if I don’t know the answer, I’ll make it up.

Elisabeth Embry 38:15
Okay, good. She Unfortunately, she was behind on listening to the podcast. So she missed the ability to go to the Oklahoma City property tour. And she was totally bummed about that, because she was really excited about being able to actually go and see the properties. And she asked the when’s the next property tour? When’s the next event? And so, when’s the next property to our wins and wins the next event, Jason?

Jason Hartman 38:40
Well, the next event that we actually have on the calendar is our big one, our big annual event meet the masters of income property in January, in the San Diego area, and people can find out about that at Jason Hartman calm and that’s a big three day conference and it’ll be awesome. We’ve got some terrific early bird price. Tickets are selling like hotcakes for that event now, but we will probably do a smaller event in the fall sometime, which will maybe be a buying event or a property tour or something. You know, look for that around October sometime.

Elisabeth Embry 39:15
Okay, terrific. Well, Jason, thanks for making the time and it might saw your whirlwind travel. It was good to catch up and have a great day.

Jason Hartman 39:26
Yep. It’s always great talking to you, Elizabeth.

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